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Getting no where :(

Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:28 pm
by SAW

My progress is cr*p :-( no matter how many dvd's I watch, clips on the net I still can't do sod all :mad: I've managed a couple of half axels oh and a turtle. I can never get into a fade from a vertical dive, can get into a fade from taking off belly down but can't hold it for long. All I seem to be good at is tangles and tip wraps #-o I feel like chucking it all in, I've got no dual line flyers near me that I know of and I could do with some tips badly :( off on hols soon and wanted to take my DS but don't think I'll bother now.

ok rant over, I'll wait for the violins :-({|= :lol:

Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:52 pm
by Jason
Where do you live?

Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 11:01 pm
by Jest_of_EVE
Dude, don't chuck it in. You're flying a Benson, not a cheap POS!

All you need to do is go slower.

This stuff takes time and you need to go at a pace. That pace is important.

One piece at a time. Just do one piece at a time over a longer period of time and you'll collect the stuff you need to do flowing freestyle.

Learn the bits, bit by bit. One day it will just hit you.

It can be frustrating. Chip up! Pick a trick and learn it (forget everything else).


Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 11:19 pm
by SteveC
Sounds like you're trying to run before you can walk, trying to do everything at once. The videos make it all look so easy but in truth it takes many many hours to get that good. Learning on your own is hard, I know, thats what I've had to do. Just take your time and get one move off at a time. if you can do a turtle, practise that until you've got it off pat. When you can put in a turtle and hold it steady, try giving a pull on one line and giving slack with the other and with luck you'll have a Lazy susan - now practise that and then move on to the next trick. It's taken me a good 18 months to get maybe 6 tricks off most of the time and another 2 or 3 on a good day. Just keep plugging away, it DOES get easier. Where are you?

Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 11:21 pm
by SAW
Where do you live?

Hampshire UK.

How do I keep the turtle in the air ? mine always fulls to the ground while getting tangled :-( tried the lazy susan not much luck there either :lol:

Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 11:52 pm
by SteveC
Which videos have you been watching? If it's Trick ot Treat or Andy Wardleys Stoked in the park or a lot of the stuff on youtube, I can see why your getting frustrated. Don't get me wrong, they are all excellent to show what CAN be done, but they can be a bit intimidating to a beginner who might think that sort of thing is the norm ( I wish!). Try watching Randy G's stuff on the net. Also try to get a copy of Dodd Gross's Flight School - I know it's a bit out of date and rather cheesy in ( a lot) of places, but it does take you from the very simplest stuff - push & pull turns etc right through to much more advanced stuff a step at a time. Shows you where you hands need to be too. I found it very helpful when I started out. As I said just keep at it, it will come.

Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 1:13 am
by Stan Doff
SAW wrote:
How do I keep the turtle in the air ? mine always fulls to the ground while getting tangled :-( tried the lazy susan not much luck there either :lol:

That Susan,she can be a real b*tch :lol:

How deep is your love?
asked the BeeGees but for you I'd say
how deep is your turtle?
I have been managing some Lazy S's on the last few trips with my "old" kite, which I used to find,if I got it on it's back,sank generating slack-line so quickly that I could not recover it.
I think the key has been to get the nose 'deep' into the turtle.I feel you have to see the back of the kite not just see the kite 'on-it's-back'.

Anyway,to reinforce what the others have said about perseverance:

I bought my first "serious" kite late 2006 and after flying it a fair bit over the following eight months I had that hopeless I bought a kite with a pedigree (Level One Genesis),and about the same time,a used Gemini and ,you know what,after a few hours flying them,I still couldn't flare them from a dive to enter a fade
But since then I've done it often and even followed up with some reasonable flic-flacs and if I can do it....... :lol:

Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 1:28 am
by Infinitive
Echoing everyone else - don't let a lack of progress get you down! It'll come, be patient.

If you're getting tangles then your slack isn't happening. Take a moment to think about your footwork - as a starter be walking forward during a trick. Unless you are in low wind, pretty much all tricks like to be walked forward.

With that slack, make your inputs lighter. The DS is a small, responsive tricker, if at first you can't do the move, try the input lighter and softer. And be walking forward.

Flying a kite is like making love to a beautiful woman. First you've got to get her in the right position. Give her some room. Then, tenderly stroke her so she responds. It is only much later when you know her intimately that she'll let you slap her about a bit.

Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:41 am
by adicakes
Hang in there - it's early days yet and the bottom line is that the learning curve is steep for what we want to achieve. You're on the right track with good gear and video tutorials, now all you need is a bit of a reality check and attitude adjustment. :)

For what it's worth, I've felt many times what you described in the top post. Heck, the first three or four months of my flying were spent just flying around in random directions like a total dickhead. Axels didn't happen until about the six or seven month mark, and it took me about eight months to hit a fade. After that, I spent quite a bit of time at the field feeling annoyed, outright angry with myself, or just disappointed at the end of the day.

The problem, I think, applies to of a lot of creative pursuits that rely on motor skills and muscle memory (e.g. playing guitar) - it seems to make perfect sense when you're an observer (you pull this string at that time and get a nice trick result) and it looks easy when the demonstrator has everything dialled in. So in your mind, you think "Yeah, that makes sense and seems do-able, I'll head out and get that working". Of course, what we've overlooked is all the nuance in timing, feel, and strength, and all of the hours spent getting those things right.

So, my advice is to bring your expectations back to more realistic measures and don't beat yourself up when things aren't working. It's not your personal failing - this stuff is hard for almost everyone. Don't worry about "freestyle" so much for now. Keep that stuff for later and concentrate on getting individual tricks going because these will form the basis for freestyle combinations later on. I'd recommend you put the lazy susan aside for awhile and have a shot at axeling instead. It'll be a great feeling when you get the first one, and the ones straight after. One thing that's been reinforced with me time and time again is that getting the first one is always the hardest part - after that, things seem to fall into place more rapidly.

Hope this helps, keep at it. :)


Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 7:09 am
by Keithgrif
SAW wrote:
Where do you live?

Hampshire UK.

You have signed up for the coaching on the Bank Holiday Monday after Portsmouth festival haven't you? ... c&start=15

Bryan wrote:
light change of timings to accomodate some coaching... All on the Monday.

10.00 AM - 12.00 Noon BFD coaching.
12.00 - 1.00 Lunch.
1.00 - (probably an hour or so) TP Workshop.

Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 8:11 am
by SAW
Thanks all :D

I'm away on holiday on the 30th so can't go on the Monday :-( but going down on the Saturday.

When I managed the odd half axel I thought yeah looked pretty cool but could I get another after, nope :?

Problem I have getting into the fade is the last bit I can get it belly down nose away but can't get the flick right to get round to the fade postion.

I think I also seem to give too much slack ? is this why I get alot of tangles/tip wraps ?


Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 1:00 pm
by jad
When belly launching to fade work on smoothly walking backwards to get air under kite.

Work in remembering that hands have switched.

Try using smooth back walking to get whatever is enough wind under the kite to keep it rising.

Note to slow or too fast effects.

Use pull for smaller adjustments to keep wings level.

For me seperating out the back walking and the slight as possible hand adjustments as seperate parts helped.

Get it to rise.......adjust with small hand motions,

Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 1:11 pm
by uktotty
Get it to rise.......adjust with small hand motions,

So true

Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:02 pm
by anomaly999
I feel your pain - am at that limbo of skill myself for over a year :)
Spookily similar.. I'm even flying a DS as well..

Nothing but myself to blame though... Just not getting any flying time in, and not making it to any events... My kids are at an age where I feel far too guilty to dissapear off on the weekend :) can't wait until they hit their teens!

I'm sure it is just a matter of perseverance... good luck with it!

Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:12 pm
by sftonkin
SAW wrote:
How do I keep the turtle in the air ? mine always fulls to the ground while getting tangled :-( tried the lazy susan not much luck there either :lol:

Most kites have "difficult" areas (ask anyone to do a normal flic-flac on a Cosmic!), and turtles/lazies are not easy on the DS. You can't let it settle into the turtle, you have to do something with it straight away. To do a lazy, pop it as soon as you can see the kite's back.