Sport, Trick and Freestyle Kite Flying Forum

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Juha
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Fri Feb 06, 2009 7:24 pm

Craig wrote:
kitekid wrote:
Later E2s had P200s so I think my point stands.

Fact of the matter is that E2's ALWAYS had P200 rods in them.


Interesting........


Well, I certainly could find no difference whatsoever when I compared the Hot Rods of my E2 with some P200's that I had.
 
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kevspilly
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Fri Feb 06, 2009 8:18 pm

Well, I certainly could find no difference whatsoever when I compared the Hot Rods of my E2 with some P200's that I had.

Specs look identical apart from a few digits after the decimal point.
They certainly look and feel the similar.
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Stan Doff
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Fri Feb 06, 2009 9:54 pm

kevspilly wrote:
[.
They certainly look and feel the similar.


Stop groping yer' rods.
 
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Zippy8
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Sat Feb 07, 2009 7:24 am

Harumph !

Often the things we need, like our APA connector fittings and Hotrods spars, simply don't exist. Then we have to design them ourselves and search far and wide for people with the skills and technology to produce them for us to our quality standards.
Mark Reed
Prism Designs Inc.
Seattle, Feb. 2003


OK so the source might be a bit dodgy :wink: but that looks very much to me like a claim from Mark Reed that he/Prism designed the Hotrod spar for their very particular requirements and not that it's a SkyShark P200 with a different label on it that they just happened to slap into the E2 like everybody else would have done.

Mike.
 
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Sat Feb 07, 2009 11:27 am

Zippy8 wrote:
Harumph !

Often the things we need, like our APA connector fittings and Hotrods spars, simply don't exist. Then we have to design them ourselves and search far and wide for people with the skills and technology to produce them for us to our quality standards.
Mark Reed
Prism Designs Inc.
Seattle, Feb. 2003


OK so the source might be a bit dodgy :wink: but that looks very much to me like a claim from Mark Reed that he/Prism designed the Hotrod spar for their very particular requirements and not that it's a SkyShark P200 with a different label on it that they just happened to slap into the E2 like everybody else would have done.

Mike.

...You have an encyclopaedic memory :D

Just a speculative thought -
Could "inventing" hot rods and then changing to Skyshark have anything to do with Skyshark P series rods changing manufacturer sometime in the last few years? - "All the new P series tubes come from a new manufacturer and we think the quality is better than ever. All of the specs are the same as before, with the exception of the P-400, which is a gram heavier."
- Rather depends what is meant by "specs" (e.g. just weight, mechnical dimensions and nominal strength, or absolutely everything including actual strength), and quality (e.g. does it include actual strength? Or perhaps the lifetime or consistency in the old product was inadequate?)
 
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Zippy8
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Sat Feb 07, 2009 12:17 pm

damp_weather wrote:
...You have an encyclopaedic memory :D

It's a character flaw I like to think I bear with good grace :P

Could "inventing" hot rods and then changing to Skyshark have anything to do with Skyshark P series rods changing manufacturer sometime in the last few years?

If, as the mysterious kitekid (whoever he may be) suggests, that Hotrod = P200 and always has then..... no. "Let's make the same thing at a different factory" does not constitute design by any rational definition of the term. Similarly "let's slap another name on a pre-existing product" isn't design either. It's marketing. And they are not the same thing at all.

Mike.
 
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kitekid
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Sat Feb 07, 2009 12:31 pm

Could "inventing" hot rods and then changing to Skyshark have anything to do with Skyshark P series rods changing manufacturer sometime in the last few years?

Interesting, except that the two events happen about 4 years apart.

OK so the source might be a bit dodgy

And we all know that every thing that is posted on internet forums is the gospel, particularly that forum :oops:
Steve
 
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Sun Feb 08, 2009 11:27 am

kitekid wrote:
Could "inventing" hot rods and then changing to Skyshark have anything to do with Skyshark P series rods changing manufacturer sometime in the last few years?

Interesting, except that the two events happen about 4 years apart.

As my partner and I only started getting involved in the stunt kite scene in the second half of 2006, we missed the whole Hotrod versus Skyshark story in the E2 (our 2006 E2 came with Skyshark) and never knew a world with Skyshark I.

- So could you please put dates on: the era of E2 Hotrods, on the change of Skyshark factory, and on the change from Skyshark I to II?

- Were Hotrods ever used in any other production kite?
 
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kevspilly
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Sun Feb 08, 2009 11:53 am

Seems strange to me that Hotrods in the E2 are of excellent quality as said before just like the P200.

However, comparing them to the New Tech P200 Chinese equivalent (used in a design not to dissimilar to the E2) is in stark contrast of quality.
The biggest problem of anything Chinese has always been the quality control. Crack this and no doubt you have it made. After all no one doubts the quality of Prism kites. All mine are well made, durable and soon on.

That said it makes me wonder why Hotrods weren’t more readily available? If Chinese production offers some what cheaper manufacturing costs. After all, to tool up and make these in a limited quantity would be prohibitive cost wise wouldn't it?
All that matters in life is kite flying, love and work ….preferably in that order.

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NEX
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Mon Feb 09, 2009 4:27 pm

There is some real crap written about the quality of Chinese products,
look about your house and you will find a Made in China label stuck on most of the electronic stuff, it works else you would have binned it.
If you want some real crap get hold of an American made Rev, rubbish fabric, stitched by the blind on piece work and then assembled by Monkeys.
Just get a kid with a cheesy smile to promote it and hey ho plenty of mugs will buy them.
 
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Craig
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Mon Feb 09, 2009 4:37 pm

NEX wrote:
There is some real crap written about the quality of Chinese products


No matter where a product is made, it comes down to quality control, Prism along with other kite manufacturers have suffered bad QC.
 
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Zippy8
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Mon Feb 09, 2009 4:39 pm

NEX wrote:
If you want some real crap get hold of an American made Rev, rubbish fabric, stitched by the blind on piece work and then assembled by Monkeys.

Authentic frontier gibberish, you've gotta love it. :-D Even I wouldn't write something like that but I don't let that stop anyone else.:wink:

Mike.
 
NEX
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Mon Feb 09, 2009 4:48 pm

Zippy8 wrote:
Authentic frontier gibberish, you've gotta love it. :-D Even I wouldn't write something like that but I don't let that stop anyone else.:wink:

Mike.


Yeh I can see how that might come over as incomprehensible technical jargon to some :P
 
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Zippy8
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Mon Feb 09, 2009 4:57 pm

 
Stan Doff
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Mon Feb 09, 2009 6:34 pm

NEX wrote:
There is some real crap written about the quality of Chinese products,
look about your house and you will find a Made in China label stuck on most of the electronic stuff, it works else you would have binned it.


Quite right,but I suspect the production technology and original developmental work are usually from Western or Japanese sources.The factory is sited in the P.R.C. (Peoples Republic of China as opposed to Taiwan) simply because it's cheaper/easier to set-up there and/or the labour is cheaper.
However,it was the case a little while ago that manufacturers of computer motherboards with quality aspirations were emphasizing their use of Japanese made capacitors,as it seemed Chinese made capacitors were considered by the market as less reliable.


Craig wrote:
No matter where a product is made, it comes down to quality control


Many years ago I read that the difference between the most prestigious (i.e. expensive) camera lenses and the cheaper independant makers was partly down to quality control.Every Lens from someone like Carl Zeiss was tested and those that did not achieve the required standard were rejected.With the cheaper lenses maybe one in ten were tested and the baseline for performance was lower.