Fractured Axel

Keithgrif · Mon Aug 03, 2009 11:15 am

Dangerous to ask I know, but what is wrong with the current format of competitions for sports kites? There must be something as the number of competitors is dropping and the uptake by newer fliers is extremely low.
Any other sport sees people competing in some form or another throughout the range of abilities, yet with kites it only seems to be the 'elite athletes' that compete, leaving it difficult to bridge the gap from beginner.

I welcome your opinions, but please try to be constructive.

VF is clearly working, why?

I have my opinions but want to hear yours

ObijuanKenobe · Mon Aug 03, 2009 11:50 am

I would venture a guess that at least part of the appeal of VF is that you can join on your own time. I think it's unfair to compare turn out in VF to turn out at your local events.

That being said, I wonder if it's more about getting people to their first competition? What I mean is, I seem to have seen in the NL that once folks fly once...they are much more likely to continue to join, as they are familiar with the other great aspects to competition (after parties, excuse to camp with friends, more flying time, etc.).

obi

kareloh · Mon Aug 03, 2009 12:29 pm

In holland, TP's are extremely relaxed and most competitors are easy going and approachable.

Most people feel right at home and even if they don't enter the comp yet, they will join after a while. It's like Obi said, it's more about the side-effects... relaxing, bbq'ing, camp out.

In another comp. format in holland, everybody is wearing the same sponsored clothing for instance... and they might be equally relaxed and easy to approach, but it might create more of a "clique" attitude for newcomers. Maybe also a bit too serious for some people.

sftonkin · Mon Aug 03, 2009 12:32 pm

I can only speak for myself (obviously), but:

Last summer I entered my first comps -- jaffa-cake cups and trick-outs -- the main thing about them was that they were fun to do. This summer I attempted one trial-format trick ladder at the spring NHK Jolly, also fun. However, because of my limitations as a flyer, I tend to avoid things where there are "tricks that you have to do to order" -- and that seeems to be the way that all the comps are going. I recognise that this is the preferred format, that I'd become a better flyer if I worked on those tricks that I can't do, and that, for better flyers, it makes a lot of sense. But, at the moment, it just doesn't appeal -- and since I'm primarily into this for fun....

Mon Aug 03, 2009 12:55 pm

Personally, it's down to balancing time and a young family.

Yan · Mon Aug 03, 2009 2:08 pm

Keithgrif wrote:
Any other sport sees people competing in some form or another throughout the range of abilities, yet with kites it only seems to be the 'elite athletes' that compete, leaving it difficult to bridge the gap from beginner.

The main difference between competitive kiting and other sports (i think) is the volume of people who compete. In other sports there are enough people in a reasonable local area to form local competitions/leagues that have a generally lower overall standard and are good places to enter your first competition, get advice on using the arena space or have time with somebody better on a regular basis. In kiteing people are so spread out that competitive meets happen infrequently and attract the 'top' flyers, so there is no 'club level' competition to ease in to.

Not sure what the solution is tho'......

Yan

Zippy8 · Mon Aug 03, 2009 2:53 pm

Part of this is that the natural progression of kite flying doesn't necessarily lead to competing. I don't imagine many beginners are starting out with dreams of one day, maybe, getting to STACK EuroCup. So you're looking for people who are both kiteflyers and are competitive, or at least interested in competing.

I've said elsewhere recently that I don't believe that format twiddling is going to help - people either want to or they don't. Some years ago I tried in vain to get a then-well-known flyer compete in an It's A Trick Out head to head event. All he had to do was step over the boundary into the field and just fly exactly the way he had been doing but.... no way. He wasn't interested and I doubt any rules change, format redefinition, etc. would have helped.

If you make your events as welcoming and as accessible as they can be without completely compromising the entire "competition" aspect then I really don't see what else you can do.

Mike.

Jest_of_EVE · Mon Aug 03, 2009 4:16 pm

I fall into Mike's category of not wishing to set the world on fire, which is just as well

I'd say work (7days) keeps me away from events that are far afield, coupled with generally not being arsed to drive a long way to fly in crappy conditions (if they happen to be crappy on the day).

If I'm at an event, coaxing me into taking part isn't too hard and it's always fun to push yourself for a few minutes.

Mark

Keithgrif · Mon Aug 03, 2009 5:37 pm

OK then, so far nothing I didn't already know. Glad to see I have the finger at least near the pulse.

Does the thought of flying with 'people' watching worry novices? Would a private novice event help lure a few out in front of a judge or two (as long as they promised not to look :-)

)?

I'm thinking winter league style but in the more hospitable seasons (can't promise sunshine). Laid back, no arena as such, a small PA, Chris Goff banned from competing :-)

Trick events and figures, a mixed event but only for less experienced (but not necessarily bad) fliers.

Thoughts?

sftonkin · Mon Aug 03, 2009 6:12 pm

Keithgrif wrote:
Does the thought of flying with 'people' watching worry novices?

There's probably as many answers to that as there are novices -- personally, I always fly worse when people are watching (that's my excuse, and I'm sticking to it!!!).

kevspilly · Mon Aug 03, 2009 7:01 pm

Personally, I always fly worse when people are watching (that's my excuse, and I'm sticking to it!!!).

Agreed, I think there must be something in that!

Seriously though I've thought about it but the travelling costs & time
have put me off. That said I do live a long way away from most meets with only one event within 1.5 hours travelling.

However, I also think after watching quietly from the sidelines for a number of years that the “bar has been raised” in the skill of top flyers.

Pity there weren’t enough flyers to have like a premier league setup.

Keithgrif · Mon Aug 03, 2009 7:17 pm

sftonkin wrote:
personally, I always fly worse when people are watching (that's my excuse, and I'm sticking to it!!!).

There is no shame in that, I could name (but I won't) a number of top class fliers I would say that of. It is often said that you should expect to loose 10% due to performing in front of an audience. The only way to overcome that is to get used to it :-(

In that way it's like public speaking. Perhaps you should imaging the judges naked :shock:

Gary Matthews · Mon Aug 03, 2009 7:21 pm

From a personal point of view, my flying improved no end, when competing, if you want to get to "their" level there's only one way......In this sport, there are no prima-donna's......Most, if not all, are approachable...unlike a lot of "elite" sportsman.

As said earlier, tricks on demand....that is a hard one to do (possibly removing that aspect)...just my opinion.

Jest_of_EVE · Mon Aug 03, 2009 7:31 pm

Back a few years I was really not into the idea of performing in front of a festival crowd, but when the time eventually came, I just didn't notice them...

...Too busy with the kite!

Mark

Sub · Mon Aug 03, 2009 8:40 pm

I've been flying in my local area for coming up to two years and STILL I'm the only one here that flies a dual line trick kite. If there was someone to compete with... well... mmm...

Keithgrif wrote:
VF is clearly working, why?

It's not a kite flying competition, it's become a glorified raffle... :evil:

Fractured Axel

COmpetition, what's wrong with it

COmpetition, what's wrong with it

Re: COmpetition, what's wrong with it

Re: COmpetition, what's wrong with it